Request for Terms and Conditions

[Explorer]

Dear Mods and Dave (owner)

I have been looking everywhere.. but have not located them.. what are the terms and conditions for this forum ?

To be straight forward for this request:
Every group, club, game etc has them.. and mostly I click them away.. however, I am on here so much.. I really want to take the time and read them.. I see a lot of advertisements.. that are customized to my recent web searches.. and I wonder, if my browsing history is being sold .. (very good money maker.. ) its like your personal info such as addresses etc..
Its IP (Intellectual property) and being on here so much.. truly, the ads on top are always according to my most recent browsing.. I really don't know what I should think about this. (privacy and all)
Its like Big brother..

Please post or email me the terms so I can read them thoroughly...

Much Thanks,
Beatrix F aka Explorer

[michiganlet]

WOW good question, I have wondering about it also since the ads started. Especially when participants are not allowed to mention and other sites.

[califblonde]

Very interesting Bea, I never thought about that. Yes the adds do show my search in the adverts.

[Bird Lady]

Good question is right! They have started showing up on my comp. also. Sure would like to get rid of them.....

[Explorer]

I think this is what might be going on..
(when I first joined I don't remember all these ads)

this is what I found in my search in a short time.. only a tip of the iceberg of information.. but a good start (PS: some forums actually warn the hosts not to be to obvious with the banners or they loose members quickly and loose money)

http://www.vbulletin-faq.com/adsense.htm

http://www.vbulletin-faq.com/making-money.htm

http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/showthread.php?t=189721

[Crys12065]

I don't remember the ads either, but is it really hurting anything? I don't know much about this stuff though.

[jodeg]

No, they haven't been here all along, just recently. I've gotten used to them. I pm'd Dave when I first saw them (he has them now on all his "Talk" forums). He said they are paid advertisements.

As far as the ads being targeted, I'm not sure how this works, but I see it all the time on my gmail (Google) page. I'm guessing Google does it. You know me, I'm hoping to see some new bird toy stores pop up!

I know no one is crazy about the ads, but the forums have expenses too, and this is one relatively painless way for Dave to earn some $$$. I'm not fully sure how this works, but I think when we click on an ad, Dave gets a little money. This way, the forum can still be free for us, and I'm sure we all want that!

[Explorer]

Well, I don't know.. I am on here so much since I am home all day until my surgery.. and these banners are really becoming annoying.. not to mention that here I google celebrity apprentice.. then switch to the forum to check latest posts.. and what do I get? an ad banner .. something celebrity apprentice.. clearly not the original though.. some other company...
so yeah.. it becomes annoying to me at least.. then I wondered (for a while now) how do they know my history? what is being accessed what cookies installed in my system to give them that info?
Before anybody can access my information legally, I have to sign the terms and conditions like it is on so many other websites that use my information for one way or another..
then I remembered.. I never signed terms and conditions.. can not find any and I emailed Dave or the mods requesting them and never heard back..

I guess it is the principal?

I want to be able to know what is being accessed and then I can make an educated decision if I ok that.. not the other way...
I can understand forum owners can make a lot of money... really the payoff comes when you have at least 1000 members and thousands of posts.. then it is a big payoff..
(just from what I read this am in their owner forum)

Now, there is nothing wrong with making money.. I just want to have said "ok" to terms to access / track my internet activity.. (legally, I doubt this is ok)

God, I wish english was my first language, because I am having difficulty trying to express what I mean :) so, I am sorry to be so long winged :)

[jodeg]

I'm sorry Dave hasn't responded yet, but I don't remember receiving an e-mail from you. This thread is the first I've seen about this subject. I don't know much else about this except what I posted above. Sorry I could be more helpful.

[Explorer]

No worries Jodeg, I used the contact us button.. not sure where it went .. I would think Dave and mods.

I get your point about a free site.. but even before all those years .. there was money made.. maybe not as much.. Sorry but, I don't think Dave runs all these forums out of the goodness of his heart.. there are fees associated with running a forum (annual etc) and they were covered in another way due to the high memberships and posts.

These banners however are a big ad on and I for one, rather pay a membership fee to avoid someone linking to my browser to get information.

If these banners are added and access our personal computers, browsing information, we should be allowed to sign off on this, not be faced with the end result.
Just my opinion.. I don't want to stir up trouble, so I hope you guys don't mind my questions and thoughts :)

If these banners would all be just bird related ads, I would not mind.. but this is a different matter :)

[MyLittleBirdie]

It's annoying to me too Explorer. BUT it's not the forum doing it. The problem is GOOGLE! If you use Google they track everything you are doing. :mad: I don't like it either and have an issue with it too but I know Google tracks everything. They use it to market ads toward what you are searching for on the internet. The owner of this site allows the ads to be placed on here and it helps them to make money. I don't know how much of our information could be sold from this forum when you sign up but some of it may be. :confused:

[unpoquito]

I'm not sure, but I'm pretty sure that the owner of this forum would never sell anyone's info to Google or anyone else. That's not the way the google ads work. It's all Google's doing.

[ninjacherry]

The issue here is with google... I get targeted ads in other websites as well, google will collect information from your searches and from your e-mails (if you use gmail like I do) to display "relevant" ads to you. It's annoying, it feels like you can't search things online because everyone will know about it! Imagine someone searching for something like an engagement ring and having Tiffany's ads all over because of this - not fun!

I won't stop coming here because of the ads, but I sure enjoy complaining about Adsense.

[Explorer]

I thought it was a google thing too until I saw this...
If you read the links I posted.. you have to ad these services manually.. additional money is made..
I am a google user too .. but this is a brand new addition to the forum.. the ad options have been around for a while.. but are only lucrative if your forum can show x amount of posts and members..

Using Google Adsense to Make Money on Your Forum


Google announced in 2003 the beginning of an income opportunity for webmasters. They simply needed to display Google's PPC (pay per click) advertising program on their own websites. For some, it was a new and extra form of income...for others it was the first chance to finally turn busy websites into money makers as well as a hobby.

To participate, you just need to place a little code and you'll see some income. Its really that easy.

Forums are a bit unique however. There are many ways to place adsense on your forum, but which are the best? How do you do it? How much can I make?

Its really not that hard to do.

Read on...


Yes, you can make money with Google Adsense. It's pretty much effortless. Once the ads are set up, it's fire and forget. You just get a check every now and then from Google. Cool huh!

You have probably seen Google Adsense ads many times, maybe not noticing them.

[Explorer]

lol ironically now, the ads displayed for me now, are all about how to make money with your forum in signing up with ad companies lol..
Since I have so much time on my hands, I can do some actual research and contact the companies to find out exactly if this is added by owner or if the owner has no control etc...

I work for a big Bio-Pharma company in the bay area in the Sales and Marketing department.. computers and internet research etc, are my speciality .. That is what I normally get paid for, to find educate myself 100% in this, will be no problem.. just takes time for me to learn it all..
Ill be sure to report back what I find out when you host a forum on vBulletin ..
:)

Still there should be some Terms and conditions here.. Any forum has them..
In an age of internet fraud and id theft.. it is very important to be informed..

For those that have been victims of identification fraud and how horrible it is when someone has taken over your financial life.. this is no small matter..
I know that some of the ads are more than questionable.. before you know it, someone has installed a cookie on your computer that tracks all your typing.. websites, email addresses and passwords.. these trojan horses are now very sophisticated and are often not even with your standard protection software detected.

One wrong click.. I lost one computer to it.. just because my son was using it clicking away.. the computer was so infected that I had to replace the hard drive.. it was the worst one I have ever encountered.. and he was on my pc laptop for 30 min lol

I love this forum.. but I do have to say, that I might have to stop coming here or maybe once a day only to look but not keep looking.. (each time you look at another post, the ads change more info is shared) I could certainly no longer post as much and post myself .. or go thru the trouble each time to run AdAware (finds hidden tracking cookies), clean my cache, browser history etc.. and I am not sure I am willing to do that..

If I can get a hold of the terms and conditions, (they should be easily posted her) I can read and make an informed decision on what is being accessed and decide if I am ok with what I am sharing.. a lot of times, I am.. I read and check ok..
Here, I would like that same choice.

really should not be unreasonable..

lol but if you find this post or me disappear suddenly.. it was not me.. if I go, I will say goodbye my friends :)

[olive0921]

I'm really glad you brought this up. I'm really surprised Dave hasn't contacted you and sent the terms & conditions.. hopefully he does.. I would be so sad if you left :(

[Dave]

Here are some explanations:

The ads are administered by Google. I have no control over what is displayed in the ads. Keep in mind, however, that the content of the ads is limited by Google's TOS (i.e. everything is family friendly). Google takes their ads very seriously. These ads are safe and are not viruses or trojan horses. There are two ways Google decides to show ads:

1. Based on your browsing history. This is why you see ads related to recent web searches and recent websites you've visted. I can guarantee you I don't sell any of your information. Here is how this works: whenever you visit a website, a file called a cookie is placed on your computer. Cookies allow for, among other things, you to stay signed in to a website after you close your browser. Google uses these cookies to see what types of websites you visit. It then finds what ads are available to display related to that topic.

2. Based on the website's content. This is why you might see a lot more parrotlet ads here than other websites. If you don't have sufficient browsing history on your computer, Google will show ads related to the current website.

If no ads related to either of the above are available, you might end up seeing a completely unrelated ad. The whole point of this technology is to show you ads that might interest you, rather than a random ad.

The majority of the ads you see online are run by Google. There is no avoiding them. I can assure you that on our end none of your information is being sold or even seen. So for example, I have no idea what ads you're seeing or what your browsing history looks like. All I see is the revenue from the ad views and/or clicks. And even then, I still don't know who clicked or viewed an ad.

Which brings me to my next explanation: why are there now ads on the website? These websites all started as a hobby for me 5 years ago. Over time, they have grown larger and larger. This resulted in me having to upgrade our server to support the large amount of data and traffic. As a student, I can't afford to pay for the server costs on my own. Therefore, ads were put in place to help subsidize the costs.

As a side note, all the expenses paid to get the sites up and running previously (previous hosting, the vBulletin licenses, etc.) were paid out of my own pocket. It wasn't until now that I began recovering those costs. Also, it should be noted that vBulletin is forum software. It is not a hosted solution. In other words, vBulletin has nothing to do with the content of this website. I'm simply using their software to power the site.

As for the terms and conditions, I apologize for not having them up here. They are currently posted at Talk Budgies (http://talkbudgies.com). I promise they will be posted here soon.

My final remark is this. I'm sorry if the ads are annoying. I've never been a fan of putting ads on my websites, but as I explained previously I had no choice. Remember that there is only one ad on this website. Think about how many more ads some other websites have, including popups and interstitial ads. We only have a simple banner ad. If you want, I can implement a paid membership to remove the ad. I didn't do this with this website because I figured it wouldn't be worth your money to pay to get rid of a single ad. But if this is something the members want, I will be glad to add some paid membership options.

I hope this puts some of your concerns at ease.

[Dave]

The TOS and Privacy Policy are now live on this website: http://talkparrotlets.com/privacy.php

[Explorer]

Hello Dave, thank you for posting the terms and conditions.. I will have to read thru this in peace :)
I am currently awaiting an answer to my information request to vBulletin regarding the google ads (emailed them earlier today)

But one thing, that seems to be an option scanning thru the terms is, to opt out of the google ads..

Advertisements
Google, as a third party vendor, uses cookies to serve ads on your site. Users may opt out of the use of the DART cookie by visiting the Google ad and content network privacy policy.

Can you please post instructions for us to do this if we want it?

Btw.. I would be very happy to pay a fee for a forum I use on a regular bases like this one.. I have before with other personal interests. I always at least felt at ease that my browsing history was not tracked and given to 3rd party sellers for advertisements etc.. :)

[Explorer]

I'm really glad you brought this up. I'm really surprised Dave hasn't contacted you and sent the terms & conditions.. hopefully he does.. I would be so sad if you left :(

Thanks :) that is sweet of you to say :) I would miss you guys too :)

[unpoquito]

Explorer,
I used to be an admin on another vbulletin forum, and can tell you that vbulletin sometimes takes forever to answer questions, and other times just doesn't. Also, Dave is correct that they have no say over the google ad content either. I've been a member of this forum for about 4 years now, and know that none of our info has ever been sold or compromised. I would really hate to see this become a paid subscription forum, because we'd likely lose some valuable contributors. I'd suggest we give Dave some time and room to come up with some other viable solutions too. Just thoughts. :) And p.s. I personally love seeing Apple with his millet beak every day. :)

[jodeg]

Unpoquito - Thanks for your post -- I totally agree!

[ninjacherry]

I thought it was a google thing too until I saw this...
If you read the links I posted.. you have to ad these services manually.. additional money is made..
I am a google user too .. but this is a brand new addition to the forum.. the ad options have been around for a while.. but are only lucrative if your forum can show x amount of posts and members..

Oh, I know that the owner added the ads manually, that's not what I meant when I blamed google - the privacy part is Google's interference, any website with google adsense will mirror the information collected by google about you. It annoys me, and it's been getting worse - I've always frequented blogs with adsense ads and the ads were not as blatantly targeted until a couple of months ago. It's been getting worse, fast.

[Birds&Horses]

You know, I have never noticed that the ads have reflected my Google searches (and being a student I use Google a LOT). I would say that 99% of the time the ads I see on this website are bird and parrotlet related.

I use Safari on my Mac and it has the option to use "private browsing" which I just have turned on all the time. It makes it so that Safari doesn't remember your search history, autofill information, etc. Obviously it is keeping this website (as well as facebook) from looking at my search history to target me for ads. Explorer, maybe this is something you could try?

I do know that Google keeps records of all searches, and supposedly would be able to track your search history back to you. I watched a CNBC special on Google (Inside the Mind of Google), and they had an interesting segment on the privacy of searches, gmail, google voice, etc. It scary that a company can know so much about you. Don't get me wrong though - I still like Google. It is unbeatable as a search engine.

[ninjacherry]

Birds&Horses: other browsers have the private browsing option as well, that's a good tip for whoever wants to keep their searches strictly private. I myself like having access to my history because I simply forget the names of websites and products I've searched, sometimes I need to look at them again... in that case the convenience of keeping the browser's history trumps privacy concerns for me.

[ninjacherry]

LOL, I'm getting a google ad for Google Ads now (on the top banner)!

[Jinx n Noodle]

I was wondering what was wrong with me, I keep getting ads about pickles. I don't remember looking at pickles!

[Explorer]

LOL, I'm getting a google ad for Google Ads now (on the top banner)!

I was wondering what was wrong with me, I keep getting ads about pickles. I don't remember looking at pickles!

lol .. I was thinking about testing it and going to a "bad you know what I mean" site lol and see what happens hi hi but the risk was to great for me .. god knows what I get after that.

hach.. and to think I used to be a big fan of google and defending them when my friends would make fun of them saying that they are getting as bad as Microsoft. :)

I remember when I used them as a search engine in the medical field.. when Yahoo and the others were on top and Google was just a little fish in the pond :) I liked the simplicity and that I was not bombarded with commercials. .(pet peeve I guess lol)

[Explorer]

Explorer,
I used to be an admin on another vbulletin forum, and can tell you that vbulletin sometimes takes forever to answer questions, and other times just doesn't. Also, Dave is correct that they have no say over the google ad content either. I've been a member of this forum for about 4 years now, and know that none of our info has ever been sold or compromised. I would really hate to see this become a paid subscription forum, because we'd likely lose some valuable contributors. I'd suggest we give Dave some time and room to come up with some other viable solutions too. Just thoughts. :) And p.s. I personally love seeing Apple with his millet beak every day. :)

Well said :) .. to be honest.. I would really hate to go.. thats why I posted.. if it were any other place, I would just go ;) This is like a 2nd home :) I would miss to many of you :)

[unpoquito]

I was wondering what was wrong with me, I keep getting ads about pickles. I don't remember looking at pickles!

LOL!!!! That's so funny!!! :D

[enborgle]

Okay, I think this thread has gone about as far as it's going to go and the mods have voted to lock for now - if anyone has any further questions, please PM Dave, as the rest of us mods have nothing to do with it and know even less about it, LOL!